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Buying a Z3 - General Info

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Paul Rice View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Paul Rice Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Buying a Z3 - General Info
    Posted: 29 Sep 2016 at 11:57pm
Chalk and Cheese
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Norrie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2016 at 10:12pm
or better still Z4 Alpina Roadster
n
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote rpennington Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2016 at 9:43pm
Originally posted by BrianMarkWilson BrianMarkWilson wrote:

what is the earliest year i can buy a z3

anyone.


Hi Brian
I think it is 1996

Regards
Rich
1999 E46 323i se Saloon - sold
2011 E90 325d msport - sold
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BrianMarkWilson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2016 at 9:15pm
what is the earliest year i can buy a z3

anyone.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote thepits Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Dec 2014 at 5:23pm
Originally posted by ruggedscot ruggedscot wrote:

Im 6' 4 so its tight in a cloth roof Z4 lol wanted a GT86 and just could not get in it at all ha ha ha...
I'd think not Cry

Originally posted by ruggedscot ruggedscot wrote:

the hydralic pump in the Z4 can get water damaged if you dont keep the drains clear, and if I remember there were a few other thing to be aware off, nothing too drastic. I had the issues with the 19" wheels.. Still its a good car and I enjoy a decent blat in it from time to time.
I'm aware of the hood drains, and so far [touching wood] mine are okay, plus I have 18" wheels, so all looks good. Big smile



So off we go, hood down, wind in the hair [Wink], sport button on ............. Clap


Edited by thepits - 10 Dec 2014 at 5:24pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ruggedscot Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Dec 2014 at 5:13pm
Im 6' 4 so its tight in a cloth roof Z4 lol wanted a GT86 and just could not get in it at all ha ha ha...

the hydralic pump in the Z4 can get water damaged if you dont keep the drains clear, and if I remember there were a few other thing to be aware off, nothing too drastic. I had the issues with the 19" wheels..

Still its a good car and I enjoy a decent blat in it from time to time.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote thepits Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Dec 2014 at 3:13pm

Originally posted by ruggedscot ruggedscot wrote:

I did try a Z3 and I also tried an earlier Z4 but my statue was a little difficult to shoehorn in lol
Shocked How tall are you? 6' in a Z4 fits ... [just] Smile

Originally posted by ruggedscot ruggedscot wrote:

And if you are aware of the issues with the Z4 I think that it would be a reasonably good car.
Issues? What issues? Confused

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AndrewE Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Dec 2014 at 9:23am
I should add - Z4 wiper racks are now £270 plus VAT. Bargain!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote safe1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Dec 2014 at 6:23pm
Thanks Mike and AndrewE for those tips---Clap----can save a fortune!!!!!
Gofastsafe
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ruggedscot Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Dec 2014 at 3:04pm
I did try a Z3 and I also tried an earlier Z4 but my statue was a little difficult to shoehorn in lol - the metal roof one well that was a nice fit. The quality issues with the SLK tended to put me off of merc. And if you are aware of the issues with the Z4 I think that it would be a reasonably good car.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AndrewE Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Dec 2014 at 9:52pm
Originally posted by Mike Fishwick Mike Fishwick wrote:

The plated bore engine (Nicsil/Alusil etc) was never used on the Z3, due to the high suphur content of American petrol, so it is something we do not need to worry about. 


If you live in the US and have a US spec car! Seriously though, very early Euro ones use a Nikasil block (not Alusil) although RealOEM says that the 2.8 has a unique engine fitted to nothing else. The Montreal blue 1997 2.8 I see every blue moon has a Nikasil engine still and it still runs okay with minimal oil usage.
US spec E36 328i's have an iron block engine - not steel linered alloy, both a proper grey cast iron block. I've not seen one of those in a Euro Z3 but I have seen a 1998 model with an alloy block and the crank sensor at the back of the block under the starter - these 'interim' engines were built in the transition from M52 to M52TU (twion Vanos) and were fitted also to the last 323i and 328i E36 Coupes, Estates and Convertibles (S, T and V plate).


Z4's: they're a nice thing but repair costs are steep and they're getting old now. They have a unique electric power steering set up that is basically a big electric motor on the column and it's a very expensive repair - just the part is £2000 with VAT! They also have an issue with the roof motor being drowned when the drain hole in the cubby hole blocks and they have issues with the Yaw rate sensor, airbag modules etc. They are a much better car than the Z3 but a lot more complex and the doors shut with a horrid tinny clang. I saw one last week where the wiper linkage had actually broken rendering the drivers wiper useless. BMW only sell a complete rack with motor for an astounding £400 but this one was fixable by altering the length of an E36 link rod with a Mig welder - a bit of applied bodging!
When the car's only worth £2500.........
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote thepits Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Dec 2014 at 8:31pm
Originally posted by Bowler Bowler wrote:

Z3 Hardcore 
Z4 for softies

You have to be Joking! Shocked

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Mike Fishwick Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Dec 2014 at 10:27am
The plated bore engine (Nicsil/Alusil etc) was never used on the Z3, due to the high suphur content of American petrol, so it is something we do not need to worry about.  All Z3 six-cylinder engines use dry steel liners, the 1.9 and M Roadster engines using an iron block.

The sill covers rot simply because owners seldon remove the wheel arch liners to clean out the mud and salt which accumulates at the end of the sill cover.  Should you have this problem, it is better and probably cheaper in the long run to fit new covers.

I bought my Z3 at 11,000 miles, and removed all the ABS sensors, greasing them before replacement, which was a very wise thing to do, and I bless my foresight when I remove the sensors for cleaning every couple of years.  I also bleed the brakes every year, and change the fluid every three, which helps to keep the hydraulic system clean.

'Training car?'  That says something about me, as after almost 15 years of ownership I obviously still need training!


Edited by Mike Fishwick - 06 Dec 2014 at 12:07pm
A Z3 is not just for Christmas - it's for life!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Paul Rice Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Dec 2014 at 11:02pm
Now there's a statement to start a debate
Z3 Hardcore 
Z4 for softies
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ruggedscot Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Dec 2014 at 7:22pm
Z3 is just the training car for the Z4.... 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote thepits Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Dec 2014 at 5:55pm

Originally posted by Mike Fishwick Mike Fishwick wrote:

Everyone should have a Z3!

Or,

Better still,

a,



 Z4 Wink



Edited by thepits - 05 Dec 2014 at 5:56pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AndrewE Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Dec 2014 at 4:56pm
Just to add from my experiences of Z3's.

The 1.9 M44 twin cam is a much better engine than the M43 1.9 (often called 1.8 by BMW - it isn't). Given oil changes etc it's just about unbreakable. The M43 though does like a head gasket. There is a plastic coolant elbow at the very back of the head and this over time will go brittle and start to leak, resulting in low coolant and overheating. There is another one on both engines that runs under the inlet manifold and they are a cow to change. (tip - remove the plastic pipe with the rubber coolant hose still fitted and remove/refit the whole lot in one go).

The 2.8's are okay but for some reason the radiator is unique to the six cylinder versions. They have a separate header tank (expansion bottle) rather than the E36 all in one design. Only BMW supply the Z3 2.8 rad in the UK and they're about £250. Double Vanos engines have the older type rad but with hoses that clip on at the engine end but use a jubilee clip the other. Z3's were very much cobbled together from what bits were vailable from the 3 Series and others - the front foglights are in fact pre 2001 E39 units.

With regard to Nikasil/Alusil; Alusil was never used on the six cylinder, just the V8 and V12 units. Nikasil was used on the M52 until March 1998 after which steel liners were fitted. Nikasil is a coating on the bores but Alusil is impregnated into the block itself. Engines were all built in Germany and shipped to the US. American market versions of cars like the E36 328i and 528i (single vanos) used an iron block that is basically the M50 type but with the crank sensor fitting into the rear of the block and not running off the crank pulley. An E36 328i engine is a straight swap but good ones are starting to get rare. US market 2.8's may well have the iron block engine. When the double Vanos units arrived in 1998, BMW went to alloy blocks with steel liners for all markets.

ABS: The four cylinder ones have the ASC+T system with the all in one ABS block and ECU - these are the 896/897 units. The ECU doesn't often fail but the valves can stick in the alloy ABS block. They are the same as used on late E36 4 cyls and pre 2001 E46 316i/318i cars. Some even have the '047' units but this is rare. There is another ABS ECU with a number that escapes me but it interchanges fine with the 896/897.
The 2.8's (well the earlier ones) use a different type of ASC+T and these have a seperate ABS ECU , the 1164 094. These are alloy bodied and are about the size of a VHS video cassette and the main problem is water ingress from a small screen leak - same problem in the E36 323i and 328i.
On both cars, a failed ABS sensor can bring on the traction control light so it's important to have the fault codes read and replace any identified sensors first. These are not easy to do - they are plastic sensors that fit into a cast iron hub and they can be very difficult to remove unlike the older type stainless steel bodied units on E30's etc. This is because the iron hub rusts and griops the plastic sensor. Fitting a new one can be even worse and you may find it won't fit. This is when you just remove the complete hub, remove the disc etc and mount it in a vice so that you can clean up the hole with a dremmel until the new sensor is a snug fit. A bonus is that with a new sensor, the ABS light will go out by itself without resetting. Or it should do!

Rust is becoming a problem now, particularly on pre facelift cars that are getting on. The outer sill panels rust at both ends and so do the bolt on front wings at the base where the outer skin wraps over the mounting frame. Rear wings rot in the same sort of fashion. I've not seen one yet with structural rust. Exhausts (even 1.9's) are expensive from BMW and aftermarket systems can be very hard to source. The fabled Z3 steering rack is also unique to the car and expensive - but I have fitted a standard E36 rack to one and it still drives okay.


Edited by AndrewE - 05 Dec 2014 at 5:02pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mscotgrove Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Dec 2014 at 12:10pm

I've had my 1.9 Z3 (auto) new since 1998.  62K.

Yesterday I had a new exhaust (first one) and new bushes on the front control arms.  I think the tramlining has been reduced very considerably.  It is still my fun car.  I enjoyed the article

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mike Fishwick Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jul 2014 at 6:29pm
It really depends on where the car has been driven, and how thoroughly it has been cleaned, but you are on the right path - the body sill covers are the first place to check, but other places such as the front chassis rails are worth looking at, along with any other box section. 

'Professional' Waxoyling?  It is easy enough to do it yourself, and you can do it better as you are not charging for labour. 

Take the front apron off and remove the bumber shock absorbers to get intothe chassis rails, the wheel arch liners to gt at the inside of the body sills, the door cards to get intothe doors, etc.

If you want to keep your Z3 in top condition for ever, you have to spend more time cleaning the underside than the bodywork!  So many owners will buy a pot of super wax for £100, yet ignore the underside, which in many cases is a mass of rust and corruption.

Sudden pulling to either side on poor road surfaces ('Tramlining') means that something is wrong at the front end.  If your tyres are not badly worn, and therer is no apparent play in the front wheels, look hard at the rubber bushes on the rear ends of the wishbones, as these are the usual culprit - see my bit in the 'How to' forum area about this, and you will see why a sudden load on the front wheels can inpart a spurious steerng input, so making the car suddenly pull to one side.  This is what the motoring hacks refer to as 'Scuttle Shake' which they claim is a sign of the body flexing . . . if ony these peple knew what they are talking about, and did not have private agendas!


Edited by Mike Fishwick - 11 Jul 2014 at 12:45pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote isittc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jul 2014 at 4:37pm
Hi, I've just joined the forum and have been the owner of a 1999 Z3 1.9 for just over a week and am looking for help, advice, inspiration. First of all I love the Z3 it is a great roadster and I'm looking to keep it for ever (or until I go gaga). 
I have several problems or issues with my car.
- it pulls left or right without warning on 'repaired' roads. Tracking was out and has been rectified but problem still persists, although nowhere near as severe. 
- the body on my car is excellent (my opinion and that of my BMW specialist) but there are early signs of rust a the front of the sill section where dirt collects, trapped between the front of the sill from and the front wheel liner. I guess I need to take the sill of and inspect it etc., and treat it but wondered generally about the availability of replacement panels for the Z3. 
- I'm tempted to have the car professional waxoyl'd and wondered if someone could point me in the direction of the rust problem areas should I decided to do it myself.
Thanks
Chris

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Paul Rice Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Aug 2013 at 12:33pm
Don't want to dwell on the ASC problem was posting as a buyers experience
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mike Fishwick Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Aug 2013 at 11:39am
Moderator Comment:

It would be a good idea to open a new post for your ASC problem, rather than use this one, which is supposed to be about buying!

Thanks,  Mike F

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Paul Rice Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Aug 2013 at 9:34am
Picked the car up yesterday, home on the busy M1 very busy stop start but car performed great not missing a beat. ASC light permanently on previous owner said by continuingly pressing ASC switch, light would go out so far this isn't happening. Could it be the switch?
Well first impressions are very positive indeed car needs a bit of fettling. mechanically seems very sound at 83k with a full service history that side looks good. Bodywork mainly chips can sought that. rear aerial seems to be totally disconnected this seems to be a non standard part will try to fit electric one. Interior very good Black leather looks superb blue roof has a couple of small blemishes but nothing to worry about. Will post some pictures when I can. thanks for the advice so far well pleased with purchase. Went out for a drive last night just for the hell of it long time since I did that,top down smelling the country air. Perfect!   
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Mike Fishwick Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Aug 2013 at 5:24pm
As we are talking about a 1.9, does it have traction control (ASC)?  I would still clean the wheel sensors anyway, simply as a routine procedure every year - it's amazing how dirty they can become. Cleaning them may not be the answer, but it does no harm.

Yes - getting them out may be a problem, but until you try you don't know.  I pulled mine out for the first time when the car had only done 15000 miles, and lightly coated their outsides with silicone grease, so have never had problems since.

Yes, I have had the ABS and ASC lights come on together, but after a decent run they both reset after switching off the ignition, so would not suggest that such a problem necessarily indicates electronic disaster.  Always try the simple things first.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Paul Rice Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Aug 2013 at 4:12pm
Hopefully by this time tomorrow I will be the proud owner of the Z and be able to look at the faults in more detail. the car I am getting for the price is streets ahead of others the roof and window are good the interior as new and all but the sensor problem mechanically sound new full exhaust inc cat, just had MOT and 30k less miles than the others I have looked at. Sorted the insurance though Adrian Flux top company staff the best I have come across £199 3k per year with £100 excess well pleased. will know more hopefully tommorow
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote DParker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Aug 2013 at 11:03am
On the Softtop replacement side of things! I have just had Blue's softtop changed. I got in touch with they guy in Swansea and he fits a softtop that is a budget replacement. The Rear window is sewn in and my old one was truthfully removed because the rear window had shattered. However when the top was removed a lot of the webbing etc was well past it's prime in fact some had disintegrated in situ but I had not seen it.

I first thought of replacing the Window but heard so many horror stories of purchases off Ebay and the zips being too long, and of people spending hours and hours fitting them that when Jack quoted me £260 for a Blue hood (mine had been black and I fancied Blue) fitted for the same price I was being Quoted for a Zipped rear screen to be fitted I decided that the hood could be changed and I would put up with a sewn in hood. 

Jack takes the approach that he is supplying a perfectly good hood which will not leak and if your a concours "type" then you should not go to him, If however you want to fix your hood because it is worn out and you need a new one that is perfectly serviceable at a budget price he will supply. I had to wait three months for a appointment he is that busy. on August the 4th he was booking in for the end of September! He is a little guy working out of a garage he does the soft tops and another guy who works in the same garage does seat repairs.

I will be at Gaydon but as I have had a crash with Blue and the bonnet is damaged, bent and dented, hence I will not be showing Blue. However I will be at Santapod with Blue and Black on September 15th so if anyone wants to see the quality of his work just roll up, and have a look Blue will be the dented Z3. (winter project to do the repairs).
Blue for the Road, Black for the Track
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote DParker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Aug 2013 at 10:50am
"IF" you are talking about the ABS light and the traction control light together, I have a couple of experiences of that symptom! Both times when eventually I got the "error codes" read the ABS pump was on it's way out (well strictly buy the time I got the codes read it had gone, and I should have got the codes read sooner). I talked to BMW and there are two parts (the electronics module and the mechanical module) and the cheapest from them, no matter what the part number is and there are many, is four figures so I used a place in Bournemouth to get it refurbished. 

I recommend splitting the unit when you get it off as the electronics could well be OK! Both times because I did not know how easy the electronics came off (4 very small bolts and the electronics slide off) I sent the whole thing and they claimed a board had been damaged! (I am pretty sure on the second one that information was certainly not correct as they tested it to the wrong specification and the initial replacement had the wrong wiring) they have since supplied the correct electronics unit.

Important thing though is to get the ABS error codes read it is false economy to guess that it is the wheel sensors. I think it is an urban myth that they cause the problem "IF" both the lights are coming on! I have only heard of people saying a mate had the problem and fixed it by cleaning the wheel sensors. It is a different matter "IF" it is ONLY the ABS light. 

I have never managed to get all four sensors out without at least one breaking. 

It is also worth noting that from elsewhere on Roadster.org there is a thread on a race car that they removed the ABS unit and "discovered that the Rear offside sensor acts as a speed sensor to the ECU and limits revs if it does not send the correct signals which it gets from the ABS unit. (that is a different problem but it does appear to support the argument that the intermittent ABS and Traction control lights warning being a sensor is urban myth.) It would also imply that if you have an ABS only light but no impact on performance the it is unlikely to be the offside rear speed sensor.

The company I used advertise that they will refurbish your own unit but for speed they sometimes use a replacement scheme and do not tell you but if you specifically say you would rather wait for your own part back I think they would oblige.

Even though I am in dispute with the company I would use them again. they are called AutoTek their support was brilliant although I had to get codes read and an auto-electrician out due to the fact that I did not know the unit supplied was the wrong one. (they have claimed that Bosch have the same part number with two different wiring pinouts and that Hazel's was the first one that they have discovered like that. I however suspect someone misread the part number when they received the part from us.)

Please be clear I am not differing with Mike Fishwick in any way the main question is when you are referring to the ABS light are you referring to ONLY the ABS light.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Mike Fishwick Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Aug 2013 at 8:26am
You have to remember that most of these cars are about 15 years old, but are lucky to heve found a 1.9 with leather!

The ABS light is most likely due to a dirty wheel sensor - they have probably never been cleaned - but the system is also sensitive to battery voltage.  The light should go out after the car is moved.

The brake pad weardown sensor operates the brake warning lamp.


Edited by Mike Fishwick - 15 Aug 2013 at 8:28am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Paul Rice Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Aug 2013 at 12:21am
Looked at several Z3 over the last few days roofs and interiors the main let down/ one very nice black 2.8 got me very interested with its exterior condition and new stainless steel exhaust a big plus but the interior door cards seats etc including roof needing replacing put me off. So I have put my hat in the ring for a low mileage 15 year old 1.9 in dark blue metallic / blue roof with the usual leather, only known fault an intermittent ABS light coming on could this be just the Brake pad wire or something more sinister?
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Paul Rice View Drop Down
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Joined: 17 Aug 2011
Location: Doncaster
Status: Offline
Points: 745
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Paul Rice Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Aug 2013 at 12:25pm
Very reasonable insurance, I have 60% no claims on a previous 2nd car so better shop around hopefully get my premiums down.
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