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Zedfest, 26 – 28 July 2013, Silverstone Circuit

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Ian Conuel View Drop Down
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    Posted: 14 Oct 2012 at 8:07pm

Calling all zed enthusiasts…

Following the huge success of the inaugural BMWCCGB zedfest in 2012 I am pleased to announce that there will be another in 2013!  The BMWCCGB are once again hosting a zed festival at the Silverstone circuit and it will be a feature event in the Silverstone Classic weekend. As last year, the BMW Car Club Zed Register is providing the unique opportunity to bring the whole zed family together for one weekend.  We are endeavouring to gather as many zeds together as possible that will culminate in a parade lap of the circuit at approximately 6pm on Saturday 27th July. The BMWCCGB is also hosting an ///M-fest at the event so, alongside our zeds, it will be a fantastic spectacle! 

The Silverstone Classic booking office has now opened and we have received a club discount code (C13225, link to booking page here) to enable zed owners displaying their cars with us on the special BMWCCGB area to receive buy one, get one free adult entrance tickets (ensure that you select one of the ‘CCM PACKAGE’ tickets). As well as the entrance tickets you’ll receive an infield display parking pass at the lowest possible purchase price up until March 31st. Note that you will need to nominate the car you will take, as the model and the registration number will be pre-printed onto the pass. Have these details available when you make your booking. 

In addition to discounted entrance tickets our friends at zroadster.org have kindly agreed to organise accommodation discount for zedfest 2013 participants and coordinate a mass convoy to Silverstone. Details here. In addition, we can take advantage of an Indian buffet on the Saturday evening at each of the Holiday Inn Express hotels for £13.95 per person. We’ll have a dedicated room set aside for us and it should provide an excellent opportunity to catch up on the day’s events when we return to the hotels after the parade lap. I’m sure you’ll realise that in order to make this viable I need to know whether you’re going to stay at one of the nominated hotels and if you will use the buffet. Please let me know on this thread and I’ll coordinate with the organisers.

If you’re not going to stay at one of the hotels then you can still take advantage of the cruise to the circuit by meeting up at either Holiday Inn Express Milton Keynes or Northampton and grab a bite of breakfast before we leave. The cruises will leave Milton Keynes at 8am, go via Holiday Inn Express Northampton before departing for Silverstone at 8.30. Take a look at this video to whet your appetite. 

I’ll keep this first post up to date with participant details and will advise of numbers registered from other forums too. Remember to keep an eye on this thread for updates of what to expect on the day. Keep your diary free for the last weekend in July 2013, it’s gonna be great!

Attending:

myredzed – z3 2.8 roadster

+11 from z4-forum.com
+3 from z3mcoupe.com



Edited by Ian Conuel - 24 Feb 2013 at 12:25pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dteagles Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Oct 2012 at 8:41am
Looking forward to it, but should I bring the M3 or the Z4 Confused

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Motorhead Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Oct 2012 at 9:42am

Why another Zedfest?

Zeds are okay, but only the Z1 can be considered a classic. To most punters, and especially those at Silverstone Classic, Z3s and Z4s are moderns. The club should celebrate something different next year.
 
Be better to have an ///M fest as most (although certainly not all) ///Ms are considered classics, especially if you limited it to cars earlier than, say, 2000.
 
Or a fest for pre-1990 BMW cars (Classicfest perhaps?) and celebrate the iconic BMW classics.
 
Lets build on the success of Zedfest and give Silverstone Classic some BMW classics next year.


Edited by Motorhead - 15 Oct 2012 at 9:48am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mike Fishwick Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Oct 2012 at 9:58am
'Classic' is such an over-used and divisive term, but it depends on what you mean by a 'Classic!'  Just about anything can now considered 'Classic' if it is:

(a) So bad that only a few were sold
(b) Popular, but rusted so badly that very few are now left
(c) Has a fragile or unreliable engine, so cannot be used much
(d) Was around when a lot of today's drivers were young
(e) Has a mind of its own, and will often perform lurid tail slides which can develop into uncontrollable girations
(f) Spare parts are almost unobtainable, and pattern parts are badly made, seldom fit without adjustment, and are ove- expensive.

So - yes - I'm afraid that the Z3 will never be considered as 'Classic' but it remains a really good car, which can be used to take you to work every day, or to anywhere which can be reached on a tarmac road - while requiring  virtually nothing but oil and filter changes, and giving the driver an enjoyable yet safe and forgiving drive.

Much as I like the Z1, I bet that if 300,000 examples  had been manufactured, its 'Classic' status would be doubted by those who do not own them!


Edited by Mike Fishwick - 15 Oct 2012 at 10:00am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JTrist Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Oct 2012 at 10:01am
Thumbs Up I totally agree it should be MFEST M1 M3 M5 M6 all pre 1990. That would be a spectacle to behold. Or all pre 1990 classic Bmws .Handshake
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dteagles Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Oct 2012 at 10:19am
Let's all hang on a minute, it will be both a Z Fest and an MPower Fest all rolled into one, we wanted to build on the success of the Z Fest and also widen the appeal and so we have added MPower....it should be a massive event.

We have not defined any "rules" for MPower but no doubt we'll have to......Ian was only advertising the Z part of this event!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Motorhead Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Oct 2012 at 10:25am
In that case Darren, bring the M3.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dteagles Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Oct 2012 at 1:01pm
I might try and get both there!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mog44t Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Oct 2012 at 8:02pm
Just wondered on what basis the Club has decided to exclude the vast swathe of other types of car from this event? It feels as if you don't have a Zed or an M you are rather second class and can't celebrate your own love of the marque in a grand fashion.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nick Wright Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Oct 2012 at 8:35pm
Originally posted by mog44t mog44t wrote:

Just wondered on what basis the Club has decided to exclude the vast swathe of other types of car from this event? It feels as if you don't have a Zed or an M you are rather second class and can't celebrate your own love of the marque in a grand fashion.

The Club doesn't exclude anyone - all BMW's are welcome.
There will more than likely be a large BMWCC stand again next year, with a generous display area available for any club member to pre-book a place 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mog44t Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Oct 2012 at 8:49pm
Thanks Nick.  I am not really interested in track days. What I am interested in is fostering the involvement of anyone in the Club who has a car and the willingness to participate.  I know from experience already that it is an uphill struggle but sectionalisng a major event does nothing to encourage others to want to get involved, from my point of view at least.  Perhaps this will get some further debate at the Regional Chairs meeting in Gaydon next month.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dteagles Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Oct 2012 at 9:06pm
We need something we can "sell" to the organisers, they aren't just going to OK to us letting all members have a parade lap otherwise every club would be doing it, I would hope though that over time we can rotate involvement and include more different models. 

Silverstone want an attraction for everyone and not just for us. You have to remember that the display and parade lap are primarily being allowed to take place so that Silverstone can attract more people and are not there to provide a lap for our members.





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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ian Conuel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Oct 2012 at 10:20pm

UPDATE 15/10/12

Take a look at the initial post for an update regarding accommodation discounts and a potential zed convoy to Silverstone.

Originally posted by dteagles dteagles wrote:

Let's all hang on a minute, it will be both a Z Fest and an MPower Fest all rolled into one, we wanted to build on the success of the Z Fest and also widen the appeal and so we have added MPower....it should be a massive event.

We have not defined any "rules" for MPower but no doubt we'll have to......Ian was only advertising the Z part of this event!


Thanks for clarifying the situation Darren. I elected not to mention the ///M Power element as I didn't want to steal the ///M Power registrars' thunder - I anticipated that they would be making their own announcements.

Wrt some of the comments regarding the other BMW marques - all I did was ask the board to consider hosting another zedfest. They had a board meeting and made a decision - I can't see what the problem is with that Confused
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Norrie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Oct 2012 at 9:27am
Gents as a non owner of either a "Z" car or a "M" car and having attended last year for 3 days, I have one request. Please, if I have to pay 108 pounds to park with the Club can we have proper hardstanding and not the grassed area which was unsuitable for parking. Indeed with respect rather than encouraging all types and new members I suspect that it may have put a few off.

I should also be interested to know how many non Club members in their Z cars have joined since their last lap on Z fest day? It is disappointing to talk to people and find out they feel they do not need to be a member to enjoy Silverstone Classic, Gaydon, trackdays etc. I know there are sound arguments and economic ones for adding non members, but disappointing never the less.
n
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mike Fishwick Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Oct 2012 at 10:09am
I know what you mean Norrie - several clubs bend over backwards to offer facilities to non-members in order to swell numbers, both at events and in use of forums, but those in favour of such moves are always reticent about spelling out any resulting increase in membership.

I have spoken to quite a few non-members who have been very satisfied in obtaining on-line assistance through club forums, but do not feel obliged to join afterwards. 

It is however difficult to be sure of who has joined after being impressed by attending a good club event.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Norrie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Oct 2012 at 11:04am
Mike, agreed. I really did not expect a definitive reply to the number who have joined, but one cannot wonder that all the time it is "open" to non members where their incentive to join is?
Perhaps there should be an associate membership so that anyone who wants to be involved in this type of activity has to join in some form, albiet at a reduced rate. Perhaps they then would not receive the magazine and be allowed to do say Silverstone, Gaydon and one trackday or something? In any event my view is in all activities Members should come first.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mike Fishwick Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Oct 2012 at 5:25pm
As one who was unable to attend Silverstone, I was a little confused by comments in Straight Six regarding the organisation of the Parade Lap - it sounded as if it was a free for all, rather than a disciplined run behind the control car.

If so, that would put off any sensible person - myself included!

Comments please?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dteagles Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Oct 2012 at 7:26pm
Mike,
It was nothing like a free for all, all that happened was that the cars got strung out a bit and so some folks were able to put there foot down a bit to "catch up" with the other cars, it was only for part of a lap and I don't think anyone was causing any danger, everyone I saw left a good gap to the car in front whilst "parading".

The answer of course is to fill the track, then there's no way anyone could get any speed up Wink

Darren.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MPLivermore Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Oct 2012 at 7:26pm
Hello Mike
 
I was lucky enough to take part in the parade lap, I would not quite call it a free for all, I did not witness any overtaking or dangerous driving, thats not to say that there was none, but... it was certainly A lot faster than we were told we would be able to travel, I think I was pretty close to 3 figures at a couple of points on the lap but was really just keeping up with the flow, the result of this was that well before the end of the lap we found ourselves in a traffic jam which I think was due to cars still entering the circuit, ( same entry and exit) Which meant cars could not leave the circuit.
I guess the answer would be to have a dedicated entry and exit point allowing a controlled flow of cars.
Also a couple more pace cars between the different categorys might help if the aim is to have a proper parade lap
Having said all that it was very enjoyable day and I would be glad to get the opportunity to do it again.
 
By the way I am a club member and agree that this sort of thing should be for paid up members only.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Norrie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Oct 2012 at 9:21am
The parade lap was very well organised and there is no way it was a "free for all". The cars lined up and we marshaled side by side to the entrance of the circuit and then proceeded in an controlled fashion around the track.

There is no doubt it made a great spectacle and was a credit to those who arranged it. There are many car clubs so it has to be attractive otherwise there would be no interest.

However, personally I think the "Z" has been done and it should move on to others that have been suggested, either real "classics" or perhaps all "M". What about Alpina only? I do not own any of these, but would like to see "others" get a look in.
n
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Motorhead Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Oct 2012 at 11:44am

The Silverstone Zed parade lap looked well organised. 

 

The other extreme were the parade laps at Le Mans Classic. These are uncontrolled (no pace cars, no speed limits) and are real free for all. Makes for great spectator viewing but we did see some cars written off in collisions. After the parade laps finished there was a stream of recovery trucks bringing in damaged classic cars that had participated in the parade laps.

 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Norrie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Oct 2012 at 11:58am
I think the Le Mans expeience put the Silverstone event into perspective, no crashes, yes it was busy and there was some queues to get on a on track, However this was a parade and not a race. I do not think anyone would want to risk their car by being competitive, it is still a spectacle at comparitively lower speed. Earlier in the year there was an event at Brands Hatch for classic cars and a parade, only one 2002 (apologies for not knowing the exact model) belonging to George Champ from the Eastern Region was there, no crashes at Brands either.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mike Fishwick Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Oct 2012 at 12:31pm
The reason for my query was the comment in the September issue of Straight Six (p.44) that:

'We were all expecting a sedate lap behind a marshal's car, but this didn't turn out to be the case for many.'

It sounded like journalistic code for motoring anarchy - glad it wasn't!

The problems at the le Mans Classic are typical of situations where otherwise sensible people surrender to the 'Group Driving Syndrome' and drive beyond their abilities with precious little anticipation, as on public days at the Nurburgring.  They forget that they are simply not used to driving at high speeds, particularly in close company - for sufferers from this syndrome a track day becomes a race, and a 'cruise' becomes a track day. 

As Dirty Harry so aptly put it - 'A man's got to know his limitations!'
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 325iRon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Oct 2012 at 9:49pm

  First off it sounds like a great idea lets do it!
  Why should we not have anther Zed Fest next year. We had a M at Gaydon last year and this year.
  No reason why we should not have an M fest as well. I am sure we will have a general club stand as well. How about the whole display incorporated with BMWs own stand I suggested this to the sales people
on the stand this.

Just why is a Z1 a Classic and not a Z3. In the December 2008 Classic & Sports Car Magazine they suggest the Z3 is a good "starter classic"

As for the Zed parade lap yes it was a lot faster than that the 35mph Silverstone recommended.
 I thought it was brilliant what a thrill to drive round the same track and sit an the same grid as the FI cars. I could not afford take my Z on track day so that was the next best thing.

Do not exclude other forums as you will find that a lot of there members are car club members as well.

Looking forward to July 2013

BMW Z3 the CLASSIC Roadster
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Norrie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Oct 2012 at 11:18pm
I think the first post indicates that it has already been decided and a date declared for the Z fest 2013, so that seems a closed decision. There is no reason in my view why it should not take place and if you have a Z car there is the added interest of a parade lap.
However, I do not think that the parade lap can or should be compared with the Silverstone track day which is a total different affair and in fact offers a level entry playing field, any BMW all you need to do is pay your fee.

I did speak to one of the BMW staff who was on the stand a Silverstone and I had previously met him and got talking at Goodwood. He basically said the the Silverstone classic was a bit of a "waste of time" as few people were genuinely interested in new BMW from a real purchasing point of view. However and more to your point he did feel that the BMW Car club would be better served being in the same area as them? That is a matter for the organisers as last year there were some lengthy negotiations right up to the last minute about where the car club would park. In the event despite printed assurances on the Silverstone web site the car club general members, Synter Alpina, BMW Classic Park Lane were all on muddy grass. The Z parking on the Sunday was not on grass, this was probably for logistical reasons as they needed to join the track fairly swiftly.
The "classic" argument can only be defined in terms of the Club by someone in authority stating what is or is not a classic, and that would not doubt provoke more discussion.
Personally I decided not to buy a Z for the pleasure of experiencing driving around Silverstone and weather permitting will be on track for the rearranged fixture from 24th Sept 12.
n
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ian Conuel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Oct 2012 at 11:20am
Originally posted by Norrie Norrie wrote:

I think the first post indicates that it has already been decided and a date declared for the Z fest 2013, so that seems a closed decision. There is no reason in my view why it should not take place and if you have a Z car there is the added interest of a parade lap.
However, I do not think that the parade lap can or should be compared with the Silverstone track day .


You're mostly correct Norrie, the board has decided that the Silverstone Classic in 2013 will host another zedfest however there is no guarantee of a parade lap for zeds. I've asked for one as it was a major attraction for all zed owners last year.

Last year's zedfest was the first BMWCCGB event I can recall that embraced all of the online forums for a specific marque. I felt that it demonstrated a willingness by the club to coordinate a major event embracing BMW zed owners even if they weren't BMWCCGB members. There was definitely an appreciation by non-club members that the BMWCCGB was a 'good thing' and I know that we recruited additional members on the back of this goodwill. I can't tell you how many because I don't know the numbers (remember it's not just about the numbers that signed up over the zedfest weekend). I also sense that the inclusion of non-club members went some way to removing a perception of 'BMWCCGB stuffiness' that pervades amongst some of those who are not/were not club members. It's also worth noting that without including permanent members we would never have got our parade lap or hard-standing parking as we wouldn't have had sufficient numbers to influence the Classic organisers.

Originally posted by Mike Fishwick Mike Fishwick wrote:

The reason for my query was the comment in the September issue of Straight Six (p.44) that:

'We were all expecting a sedate lap behind a marshal's car, but this didn't turn out to be the case for many.'

It sounded like journalistic code for motoring anarchy - glad it wasn't!


I wrote those words Mike so it's probably worth highlighting that, as I'm not a journalist, there was no code or hidden message! Prior to the event I anticipated a 2 x 2 pace lap at sedate speed behind a marshall's car. In reality several of us further down the grid had plenty of space in front of our cars so were able to accelerate into it to catch up with the pack.

Following the success of last year's event I was always planning to do something similar in 2013 i.e. coordinate a cross-forum event under the BMWCCGB banner. The Silverstone Classic worked very well so I was obviously keen to see if I could make use of it once again. To date, response across the forums has been extremely positive so there's clearly an appetite. What we should probably consider is how can we reward those participants that are BMWCCGB members at the event. All ideas gratefully received...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mike Fishwick Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Oct 2012 at 12:56pm
As the event is to be held over the weekend, will camping facilities be available?  If so, it would make the event far more viable to many people.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dteagles Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Oct 2012 at 1:06pm
There were camping facilities last year so I don't see any reason why there wouldn't be this year.

I don't know what the arrangements were though in terms of prices/facilities.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mike Fishwick Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Oct 2012 at 1:37pm
The camp site was not part of the BMWCC package this year - it was not thought there would be enough people who wanted to use it, although there is a good site just outside the gate at:

www.silverstone-camping.co.uk

I think the important thing is to decide whether the on-circuit camping is going to be used, and advise people at an early stage that we will be using one site or the other.




Edited by Mike Fishwick - 21 Oct 2012 at 1:42pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Norrie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Oct 2012 at 4:18pm
There were a number of people I know what camped and they seemed to get on with it Ok. This was part of the Silverstone organisation as opposed to the Club I believe. Clearly the weather is a massive factor in this. 

However, there are a number of hotel deals in and around the area and I found that booking in advance a 4 star for 41 pounds for a double to be exceptional value. I gave up camping when I left HM Forces many years ago, but can see the benefit of being on site and especially fo those who like to stay for the musical entertainment and like an alcoholic drink.

I accept that the Z fest needs outside forums or groups to make up the numbers, but really cannot work out if this is a Z fest meeting and the Car club is just a convenient platform for entry or if it is a BMWCCGB event?

If there is no guarantee of a lap for the Z, what then is the attraction? Anyone can buy a ticket for the Classic, anyone in the Car club car buy a ticket and park with the club, so what is it? Do you mean that non club members only want to park with other Z cars, if so what has that got to do with the club? That could be arranged surely by anyone. I really struggle to understand a club that invites all to join, whatever the BMW, age, condition, type, quality, specification and then keeps making specialist groups somewhat to the exclusion of others, whilst they are not totally excluded they are overshadowed. 

We have recently seen reference in the magazine to people using first name terms at an event who are not even club members, they feel no pain by not joining as they are constantly accommodated by the Club wanting to boost it's reputation, image or even ego. Who would not want to have the choice to pick out the good parts of any club without paying a membership?

Is there any major event that just puts any BMW club owner next to another without breaking the down into groups of sections? I think it would be quite spectacular to see 30-40 different models mixed up in one location. Whilst I am keen to encourage non members and I keener to to include all members and not just ones in elite groups.

In fact we proved this in the Wessex region at Gaydon, details were in the last magazine. I spoke to around 10 people who were members but were not considering going to Gaydon because their car was not good enough. We told them that if they we in our region they could park in the Wessex and would be welcome no matter what car, we had 5 times the number of cars compared to the previous year, whilst still having Wessex members in the Alpina, track day, M power etc.

Specialist groups are important and great for the owners. but please also consider others who may not own or cannot afford some of the more expensive or attractive cars.


Edited by NeRo - 21 Oct 2012 at 5:14pm
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